Does this mean I can stop my sacrifices to the server gods?
I am glad this wasn’t an object lesson on the Lord giving and taking away. I appreciated the chance to check out some of your blogs and came away with all kinds of self-improvement projects. Peripheral inspiration, pretty cool!
Mary> Your comment made me laugh. My husband’s parents had 6 kids who used to tease them on road trips by saying “Mom, Dad! We forgot ______” only to have said so-and-so pop up 2 minutes later from under the seat (no seatbelts in those days). This never-cry-wolf game resulted eventually in my husband being left behind at a gas station at a tender age for a couple of hours. It took the kids a while to convince their parents that they really had forgotten him.
For his part, hubby found 5 dollars on the ground, bought himself some ice cream and sat on the curb to wait. LOL
Comment by xenologue — February 9, 2010 @ 12:51 pm
Good enough? Man, I’m getting my bike tuned up, thanks to you. If I’d read any further, maybe I’d be putting in a chicken coop this weekend!
I missed FMH, but it was great to peek around at other blogs! But I think even my husband noticed my withdrawal…
I really would like to continue “Walk a mile in my shoes” with one question - Where do people draw the imaginary line between benefits of society that are considered ok and good, like roads, police, fire, schools, universities (which are heavily tax-payer subsidized in many cases) and what they consider bad, and call welfare, from TANF to WIC. Plus, the difference between our parent’s and grandparents generation and ourselves (in self-sufficiency being possible on one income, or two even, then versus now) But if it is lost in the internet graveyard… I will pout on my own.
There are no good excuses. Just sometimes, I need a break and the plate in front of my gets awfully awfully full.. and then overflows… and now the table cloth needs spot remover, etc.
You’ll be happy to know we’ve weathered re-entry of a missionary, sent one back to school, sent one to school (the cost of two college freshman - ouch!), we still have two in high school here and we’ve reduced our foot print down to two continents.
In the meantime, I’ve hit the 1/3 completed mark of graduate school, my research article was finally published (1st author - whee!), and we threw in a Christmas trip that was Paris, London, Brussels (for 6) - just for good measure.
Somehow I managed to stay mostly current on my lil personal blog.
Thank Jesus for Diet Coke, good husbands, bright capable women, and sobriety.
I haven’t had to plan to a homocide or a suicide in a very long time. That makes this a most outstanding Tuesday.
#16 - mfranti - I imagined you said “harumphhh” just like Kerry Jackson on RFH. And your place is totally good enough! For some reason I felt the freedom to be a lot sillier on your blog than on this one. Weird.
Since we’re not talking about anything particularly pointed, may I use this opportunity to ask if anyone had any ideas about how to get a UT valleyish snacker together while Bridget Jack Meyers is here in (I think) April? I
I so hope you don’t post that poll over here, mel. I hate having to admit that I am Republican (as evidenced by the fact that I am going to vote in the Republican Primary for Texas Governor, I suppose) when I read things like that.
Comment by StillConfused — February 9, 2010 @ 4:03 pm
Lupita, you are in rare form today. LOL!!!
CWC, I’d love to get together. Maybe we can brain storm for the greater CLP get together I am working on that we will make sure Mike can come to. At least the snacker part.
Stephanie, as a frothing at the mouth liberal (but the froth always matches my shawl) that disagrees with you on pretty much every issue, You’re the loyal opposition. Or, perhaps it’s me.
The problem isn’t being Republican, it’s being one of those people who incorrectly call themselves Republicans who think those truly scary things that mfranti’s poll showed. You know, thinking Obama wants the Terrorists to win (???????) and that Acorn (an organization with almost no power) somehow threw the election to Obama. I’m calling them Palinistas.
Ummm SLC might be in range… I have family down there so It may be doable…. SE Idaho here… but there will NEVER be a snacker here due to rabid redstate tendencies. Maybe I can get a carpool going or something.
ha! djinn - I have met a few repubs that think those things from the poll. but I think they have mental problems. No -seriously, nut job types with paranoid delusions. I’m not a republican, though… not after living in Utah for a little while…
Now for either a moment of rare candor, or a common moment of toomuchinformation (the others of which I have blissfully forgotten)–I’m pretty much housebound due to all the usual suspects; hanging out here is for me what passes to hanging out with friends. I’m extremely social, even in my rather exaggeratedly muted state; sorry for all the drama, mostly.
Between “frothing at the mouth liberal” and “rabid redstate tendencies” … sounds like FMH is either behind on its immunizations or in need of a fresh 52oz ice cold fountain diet coke.
I’m gonna err on the side of caution and suggest a diet coke. If tomorrow, someone else is showing symptoms, we’ll just line up in the cafeteria and roll up our left sleeves - we can kick it old school.
It’s still a great Tuesday … even though there isn’t much left of it. Make it a good one sisters and brothers!
“A cool name, given to a girl. Appears to contain the magical property of forcing others to ask the same question when it is first heard, regardless of good sense.
‘Hey, what’s your name?’
‘April.’
‘Oh, so were you born in April?’
‘Shut up.’ “
Comment by Natalie K. — February 9, 2010 @ 4:42 pm
My dad’s a tea party conservative- he went to his first demonstration/protest ever last year. I told him not to get himself arrested like all those hippies he used to go on and on about in the 70’s… Anyhoo, whatever the cause, I like to see people demonstrating when they are passionate about something. It’s apathy that’s gonna get us in the end…not demonstrations.
I happen to agree fully Kimberly! Though I have issues with some of the things about the Tea Parties I tend to believe that it is mostly normal people that are just tired of the “politics as usual” and need to stand up and be heard.
I could not disagree more Kimberly. The tea party ‘conservatives’ give me true terrors. They are wrong. You know they are wrong. That sort of wrong has led to quite a number of atrocities in the last century, I’ll forgo mentioning the most obvious one.
It’s bad for people to be so misinformed in such a way that undermines our democracy.
I disagree with your politics, Kimberly, you disagree with mine. FIne; this is what democracy is all about. However, we both understand the sky is blue.
Teabaggers, not so much. What can you say except “Your version of reality does not intersect the actual world.” Scary. Scary. Scary.
Speaking of misinformation, I’ve got an over-ripe Glenn Beck dvd I received for Christmas here. If Deseret Book won’t exchange it for candy, I’d be willing to donate it to UT snacker festivities.
Although I lament dragging down the light-hearted, thong-themed tone, I have to agree with djinn here.
I think it is decidedly NOT better for people to be agitating for a certain position instead of being apathetic. The positions held by the Tea Party Convention are damaging, and have hurt a great deal of people the world over. Adding to their numbers by attending protests only helps legitimize their points of view, and cause further harm.
Unless maybe you went in a thong.
That could be fighting the good fight.
Comment by Natalie K. — February 9, 2010 @ 5:11 pm
Moniker Challenged: and what are we supposed to do with a Glenn Beck CD? That would certainly ruin the snacker for me. Unless of course….. oh, never mind…. that thought was bad….
Some one could re-gift it, or melt it in the microwave, or use it to keep swallows from building under their eves? I didn’t mean it was necessarily for diligent study. I’m just trying to recycle, reduce, and re-use here.
I guess this is as good a thread as any to announce that I’m officially changing my tag, due to the overabundance of various forms of Natalie on the bloggernacle.
So hi everyone. I’m Hammie now.
Comment by Hammie (formerly known as Natalie K.) — February 9, 2010 @ 5:18 pm
I don’t dislike anyone enough to re-gift it and I would rather have swallows in my eaves than that CD hanging around my house where someone could see it. The microwave is a real possibility.
Comment by Hammie (formerly known as Natalie K.) — February 9, 2010 @ 5:22 pm
All bets are off. They’ll give me $19.95 in candy purchase power. I’m afraid me selfish desire for sweeties is overriding my altruistic desire to not unleash this evil on the world.
Lol. Actually, Hammie based on the childhood nickname I had because of my maiden name (Hamilton), but I’m kinda like a hyper squirrel, so that’s good too.
Comment by Hammie (formerly known as Natalie K.) — February 9, 2010 @ 5:34 pm
hehe… if you give you caffeine will the world go into slow mo for you?
ummm my birthday is close to May… but I wonder if the prospect of naming a little girl May would have zapped my parents out of their apathetic state enough to name me something else They were (after all) sure, SURE I was going to be a boy. lol
Welcome back! I knew you’d make it work sooner or later. Nice blog mfranti.
Rather than be scared by those statistics, I suspected they were cooked a bit. That’s not like Republicans I know, at least not in those numbers.
Comment by Mommie Dearest — February 9, 2010 @ 5:52 pm
That’s a good point, Mommie Dearest. It’s not like most Republicans I know either - a handful, maybe - but definitely not most.
Hmmm well while the company is considered non-partisan the poll was made to Kos’s specifics…. So likely the nature of the questions COULD lean one way or another…
Hmmmm democratic stereotype?
“Do you think George Bush should currently be in prison, yes or no?”
“Do you think Cheney is the anti-Christ? Yes or no?”
“Do you agree with redistributing wealth? Yes or no?”
“Do you think all Republicans are evil? Yes or no?”
“Do you believe that all illegal immigrants should be granted citizenship? Yes or no?”
what would a democratic stereotype poll look like?
mfranti, that’s an easy one.
At least one third of self-identified liberal people believe all of the following, as multiple polls attest :
- George W. Bush intentionally caused 9/11. What can you even say to that, except welcome to the nuthouse?
- Iraqi civilian casualties exceeded 5 million deaths (real number = 125,000 - 175,000). That’s still a lot, but the continual and outrageous exaggeration of civilian casualties demonstrates how detached some of us are from reality.
- George W. Bush stole the election from Al W. Gore. This continues to be repeated, in spite of a thorough debunking of the idea by the NY Times.
The nuts are all over the political map. The poll you posted is scary, but no more scary than usual.
Comment by Mark Brown — February 9, 2010 @ 6:32 pm
LOL How about this.
“Do you think American Military presence in other countries is bad? Yes or no”
“Do you think the majority of the American Populace is ignorant? Yes or no”
“Do you think the news media has a right to withhold information from the public because it is deemed ‘too complex’ for the public to understand? Yes or no”
“Do you think the government should dictate what is “right” despite what the general populace seems to think? Yes or no?”
No, it’s just my impression that many feel that by allowing home school they are allowing “fundamentalists” to teach their children bigotry etc. Also it allows parents to have their own curriculum, including things that are not allowed in public schools.
As a disclaimer I have nothing against homeschooling and think it works wonderfully for some children.
I don’t know if it’s considered self-reliant…. and if it is, by whom. Not really knowledgeable on it actually. Just have a couple of friends who are VERY defensive about it who are Republicans.
Hi ya’ll so nice to see everyone! I just had a crazy volunteer at school day and now I have an hour to write a little talk for the meetingformerlyknownasenrichment so no time to hang out. But tomorrow I should be able to hand out a bit! Yay, the blog is back!
Mark, did you hear that This American Life about the casualty numbers? You should look it up, sooooo interesting. I’ll find a link after the writing a talk pressure is off.
Comment by Mark Brown — February 9, 2010 @ 7:48 pm
did you save it Cecile? I would love to read it again and keep discussing it. I think it is central to our political problems currently, the ways we view the government and helping our fellow Americans.
April, I have a friend named July (pronounced Julie), who was born in July. She has a sister also named after her birth month, but I can’t remember which month it is.
I’d be up for a Salt Lake snacker, as long as my freak random shyness didn’t prevent me from coming.
The positions held by the Tea Party Convention are damaging, and have hurt a great deal of people the world over. Adding to their numbers by attending protests only helps legitimize their points of view, and cause further harm.
Ok, this is an honest question. I’m not trying to argue or be rhetorical (did I spell that right?).
What is it that the Tea Party people do/believe that is so hurtful? I thought they were a movement promoting fiscal responsibility and small government. In your opinion is that was causes harm to people all over the world or is there something I’m missing?
Repost it! I didn’t see it before the server crashed, and I’d like to. And yours must be cached, mfranti, because that link doesn’t pull up anything for me.
Theolina… I kinda want to know the answer to that too actually. I don’t think being financially responsible is bad, be in individually or for a government.
At least one third of self-identified liberal people believe all of the following, as multiple polls attest :
- George W. Bush intentionally caused 9/11. What can you even say to that, except welcome to the nuthouse?
- Iraqi civilian casualties exceeded 5 million deaths (real number = 125,000 - 175,000). That’s still a lot, but the continual and outrageous exaggeration of civilian casualties demonstrates how detached some of us are from reality.
- George W. Bush stole the election from Al W. Gore. This continues to be repeated, in spite of a thorough debunking of the idea by the NY Times.
The nuts are all over the political map. The poll you posted is scary, but no more scary than usual.
Comment by Mark Brown — February 9, 2010 @ 6:32 pm
First point–Bush causing 9-11. Wha? Huh? What? Provide references that some percentage of liberals believe this or I’m writing it off as simply false.
2nd point: Iraq war casualties. Provide proof that those scary liberals belive that they’re in the 5 Million mark, because, I have never heard such a number used. Two peer-reviewed surveys have been performed, and provide much higher death rates than you give.
Using peer-reviewd studies only, in Iraq, around 655,000 to 1.2 Million excess people died because of our invasion, depending upon which peer reviewed suryey you quote.
I am (sadly) aware that the perfectly fine Lancet survey (655.000 deaths) was attacked with quite the venom by statistically-innocent pundits. The 2nd peer-review study, the ORB account, which gave the higher number of 1.2 million, escaped such vehemence, even from the US right. I guess they couldn’t find anything to complain about.
Many people died. Many more, like ten times more, than you admit, Mark Brown. Eveif you don’t like it, Mark Brown. The point here is that “liberals” believe that somewhere between a half million and 1.2 million excess people died because the US attacted Iraq. This belief is true.
Now, on to the election of George Bush.
The Supreme Court handed the election to George Bush, and knew it, as their reasoning was so specious they refused to allow the opinion to be used as future precedence.
Justice Stevens, an actual Supreme Court justice, had the following to say about the majority opinion:
What must underlie petitioners’ entire federal assault on the Florida election procedures is an unstated lack of confidence in the impartiality and capacity of the state judges who would make the critical decisions if the vote count were to proceed. Otherwise, their position is wholly without merit. The endorsement of that position by the majority of this Court can only lend credence to the most cynical appraisal of the work of judges throughout the land. It is confidence in the men and women who administer the judicial system that is the true backbone of the rule of law. Time will one day heal the wound to that confidence that will be inflicted by today’s decision. One thing, however, is certain. Although we may never know with complete certainty the identity of the winner of this year’s Presidential election, the identity of the loser is perfectly clear. It is the Nation’s confidence in the judge as an impartial guardian of the rule of law
.
If a member of the Supreme Court of the United States is that furious about the Bush v. Gore opinion, than an everyday citizen can hold a similar opinion without being thought as anything but a responsible citizen. \
Compare this with the number of Americans who think Obama is in league with the terrorists. What are they talking about? What evidence do they have? Where do they buy the tinfoil from which they fashion their shiny hats?
See the difference? One side has facts. The other side has paranoid fact-free fantasies.
I actually got scared that you started blocking the site to foreign IP addresses (the way Hulu.com and NBC.com do, so I can’t watch any of my shows here in Tokyo).
I wonder, are there are any other fmh readers in Tokyo? I’m Catholic, not LDS, so haven’t had many opportunities to find out — but would love to have a “Far East snacker.” (Or maybe I am the only one, in which case, I would get to eat all the snacks myself).
As per the inestimable Jack’s comment way way way back up at comment #2. The Danites were also called “The Daughters of Zion.” I’m totally signing up (for my favorite issues, only). 19th century Mormon gender-bending. Too cool.
I guess we could argue about the difference between causing 9/11 (my words) and knowing about it in advance and doing nothing to stop it. But I don’t think there is a moral difference. Anyway, it’s worse than I thought. Fully 61% of Democrats either believed it or at least thought it might be true. Like I said before, welcome to the nuthouse.
As to Iraqi casualties, I’m going with the WHO. They had 1000 samples, Lancet only had 47. The study with 20 times as much data is very likely to be the more accurate study. You can disagree, and that’s fine. But please spare me all the talk about one side having all the facts and the other side dealing in fact free fantasies. There’s plenty of ignorance and fear to go around, as your comment amply demonstrates.
Comment by Mark Brown — February 9, 2010 @ 9:27 pm
And after Lancet’s latest retraction of its bogus study which purported to show that childhood inoculations cause autism, I am astonished — absolutely dumbfounded — that anybody takes them seriously anymore. They literally just make stuff up and peddle it gullible, paranoid people.
Comment by Mark Brown — February 9, 2010 @ 9:31 pm
aw L.! I was in seoul til just a couple of months ago. im back in the US now, but it’s nice to know i wasn’t the only FMHer in or near the land of the rising sun!
Comment by nobodyputsbabyinacorner — February 9, 2010 @ 9:41 pm
we could have had those crunchy salty fish things for snacks, or the gooby things filled with mugwort. mmm.
Comment by nobodyputsbabyinacorner — February 9, 2010 @ 9:42 pm
I am only in town for the weekend so who wants to name a park? I’ll be there, Noodle, Lynette from ZD, Jeanine, Chandelle (yes, I read that as confirmation, Chandelle) and who else?
We’ll picnic, we’ll cavort, we’ll bless our daughters in the ocean. Well, some of that.
Name a time and park, someone who knows the city!
Oh and I may bring my charming, handsome, single non-LDS BFF - you are all welcome to “flirt to convert.”
I’d love to see him married to a nice Mormon feminist
Hey! If there’s a Utah snacker, I can make it on a weekend - or even a Friday later afternoon. I’m in Boise for the semester, but will drive down to meet and greet. Especially if Jack is in town.
Comment by that1girl — February 9, 2010 @ 11:02 pm
I think I had a terribly thought provoking and deep comment to one of these posts that got lost in the thing that happened. It was a real mind blower too.
Comment by SUNNofaB.C.Rich — February 9, 2010 @ 11:11 pm
48-
I would love another Utah snacker! And so would my husband! My 3-year-old still talks about the last one occasionally.
Mark Brown, once it had been shown that Andrew Wakefield faked his “vaccines cause autism results,” Lancet behaved properly and renounced the study. That’s how science works, and makes Lancet more, not less reliable. There were somewhere between 600+ thousand and over a million excess deaths in Iraq due to the Iraq war. I noticed you haven’t bothered to dispute the ORB study; as far as I can tell it’s indisputible, but I’m open to evidence showing otherwise.
As to the Bush/Gore presidential election thing, it was a close call according to any study. But take a gander at how statewide recounts pretty much universally would have given the election to Gore. The one that didn’t invade Iraq on totally made-up evidence.
(From WIkipedia)
Review of all ballots statewide (never undertaken)
• Standard as set by each county canvassing board during their survey Gore by 171
• Fully punched chad and limited marks on optical ballots Gore by 115
• Any dimples or optical mark Gore by 107
• One corner of chad detached or optical mark Gore by 60
Gore wins them all.
I’m horrified by the Rasmussen study you cited that showed that 33% of Democrats believed that Bush had something to do with 9-11, so I’ll give you that one. Totally creepy. Ugh. Ugh. Ugh.
Both sides have faults. BUt your side is worse. And listenes to totally lame music.
So, none of this calling Obama a terrorist-lover, OK? It’s just not true, and I worry about his survival. For reals.
:
The remark “But your side is worse. And listenes to totally lame music.” was my attempt at lightening the conversation by saying something obviously false and unsupportable. But my sense of humor is somewhat obscure. So there is the remains of my joke. like a patient etherized upon a table.
Also, not to seem even more crass than is my due. Thank you thank you thank you FMH for being back up; and thank you thank you thank you commmenters for giving me something to comment about. Thanks. <3
Disagree re: Lancet. Their research on the topic of vaccines and autism has been under fire for years. It is incredible that it took them this long to retract.
I noticed you haven’t bothered to dispute the ORB study; as far as I can tell it’s indisputible, but I’m open to evidence showing otherwise.
I think the burden of proof is on you to explain why you think the ORB study is accurate. Lancet, ORB and WHO all used the same research methodology, so the methods are not in dispute. ORB sampled in 15 sectors, Lancet in 47, and WHO in 1,000. Common sense would tell us that the largest sample size is very, very likely to be more accurate. Can you explain why you do not think that?
The Wiki article you cite refutes rather than confirms your statement. The part you cite notes that it is the outcome of only one study and that clarification is needed. The rest of the article supports my position, to wit:
The results of the study showed that had the limited county by county recounts requested by the Gore team been completed, Bush would still have been the winner of the election.
and
The media recount study found that under the system of limited recounts in selected counties as was requested by the Gore campaign, the only way that Gore would have won was by using counting methods that were never requested by any party
Both sides have faults. BUt your side is worse. And listenes to totally lame music.
Agreed. But you probably ought to be a little more careful with your assumptions about which side I am on.
Comment by Mark Brown — February 10, 2010 @ 10:56 am
I just wanna brag and tell you that Quimby stopped by and commented on the fmh thread at my blog yesterday.
ahh we’re back, we’ve ignorantly insulted homeschoolers and republicans and assumed that any opinion we like is reasonable as long as ONE supreme court justice agrees.
I think it’s Aprils thrown out there comments theorizing why some people might be against homeschool-then balancing it out by saying it might work for some children and might be considered self reliant bysomebdody. oh and some vague republicans are defensive about it —perhaps that is all meant as a glowing endorsment…after all it might work for some children as long as their parents have recognizable views I agree with and thus isn’t indoctrination…
Here are two fun democratic assumptions besides the obvious 9/11 and Bush stealing elections…
Can you be against socialized medicine(or even this bill) and compassionate?
Are men and women different? ( yes or no…but please measure the squirming time and number of answer changes)
Comment by Stephanie — February 10, 2010 @ 2:46 pm
Did not mean to insult homeschoolers- I would love to do it, but I’m a little lazy. And I calculated I would have to live here 140 years to pay for my kids education through property and sales tax, etc. So I’m a “drain” on the taxpayers, (going back to the welfare argument of the lost post).
Comment by SarahJane — February 10, 2010 @ 5:26 pm
Also it allows parents to have their own curriculum, including things that are not allowed in public schools.
This quote scares me a bit.
Are there really people out there who think that the public schools should dictate what parents are or aren’t allowed to teach their chidlren (even weird fundamentalist views?) The day the government forces parents to teach their children a gov’t approved curriculum is the day we’ve *truly* started to succumb to some kind of fascist regime, IMHO.
Sorry to be so flame-ish. It just really scares me, that comment.
Mark Brown, the Florida Supreme Court had ordered a statewide madated recount which by every measure i have been able to find would have given the election to Gore.
It was only the intervention of the United States Supreme Court that required those conservative (only when useful) Supreme Court justices to totally and completely abandon their previously articulated states’ rights principles to stop the recount and hand over the election to Bush. Shamefully. As I mentioned earlier, the opinion cannot be used as precedent. Why? Because they’re ashamed of it? One may speculate.
On to the number of Iraqis killed during the Iraq war. Your favorite measure appears to be the World Health Organization report published by the New England Journal of Medicine (I think. I couldn’t quite tell, so if I’m wrong, please let me know.) That report stated (in an appendix that required a couple of numbers be multiplied together) that the Iraq war has produced 400,000 excess Iraqi deaths as of June, 2006. Note, this is different than violent deaths, but if your child dies because he gets dynastery from an unclean water supply, he’s as dead as if shot.
Now, it’s Feb. 2010. The most dangerous period of the Iraq war was from late 2006 through 2007. Not adjusting the numbers at all, but extrapolating from the 2003- 2006 numbers to today, we get, conservatively, 700,000 excess dead Iraquis.
Plus, there’s 4 million (roughly) Iraqi refugees in and out of the country, over 20% of the Iraqi babies are chronically malnourished, and the list of the horrors goes on. Go us.
I am so glad you are back fmh. Salt Lake Snacker? I am in….but lets for go the park idea…too cold. Do we need a house..mine is open.
Way back on #18…we just had family pictures done with my 4 kids and 3 dogs. When we started to pile out of the mini van a half hour later for lunch we realized we had left one of the dogs at the studio…..That was a little embarrassing….we love him enough to put him in our family pictures but not enough to take him home.
I have a friend who tells me if I lived in another state I would know just as many crazy democrats. But I live in UT, so we get mostly republician parinoia. We had one guy try to get us to all take our kids out of school and form a neighborhood school because public schools are close to socialism. He forced his overwhelmed wife to pull their 6 kids. She refused to teach them because she was so mad. He said he would….eight weeks later they were all back in school. Side note….I do homeschool one of my 4, because it is right for him, not because I am afraid of the goverment.
Comment by kandi and salt — February 10, 2010 @ 8:25 pm
I realize I’m late to the party, but i brought treats!
Questions/Answers:
“Do you think George Bush should currently be in prison, yes or no?”
George Bush should be in the Hague for War Crimes
“Do you think Cheney is the anti-Christ? Yes or no?”
No. However, like his President, Cheney should be in the Hague charged with war crimes.
“Do you agree with redistributing wealth? Yes or no?”
We have taxes. That was the entire point of the Constitution. That famous one, that I (totally guessing here) are for. the one passed in 1788. Of course. It redistributes wealth for the specific reason that the Articles of Confederation did not give enough taxing authority to the central government and were unworkable.
“Do you think all Republicans are evil? Yes or no?”
Of course not. Knowing someone is Republican tells you very little about them.
“Do you believe that all illegal immigrants should be granted citizenship? Yes or no?”
No. This is a stupid question, which by its very phrasology assumes that all people who are in the country illegally share some common characteristic rather than the stated one. As a thought experiment, all you mothers out there, imagine yourselves illegal aliens with American children. (Perhaps your parents brought you to the us when you were under a year old.) Perhaps you married a citizen without all your paperwork crossing its t’s and dotting its i’s.
How many of you are willing to abandon your children to go back to your country of origin to wait the extended time for your appropriate visa to come through, if at all?
Or, Mark Brown, is your point that 700,000 dead Iraqis (as determined by the original WHO study that you positively reviewed, which I scaled to today, ignoring the escalating violence from the period after the initial death reports –2006 to early 2008) is just totally cool? I mean, they’re not (insert appropriate group you feel appropriate here.)
Mark Brown, what were we arguing about? Oh, yeah, What You clearly think that killing somewere in excess of 500,000 Iraqis (notice that i am totally lowballing (to a degree I find disconcerting) the numbers of deaths according to all studies including the ones you appear to agree with) is like totally KOOLLLL!!!! Because, uh, because– Osama Bin Laden was born in the country next door, even though he belonged to the wrong religion and really really didn’t like those [warning, requires a bit of history] those conquerers of his people who had this annoying habit of treating them rather poorly?
Remember all. To keep your server happy, sacrifice the occasionally xkcd comic. Appropriate measures are, but not limitied to, burning, burying, or making something with chocolate when thinking of it.
Comment by Mark Brown — February 10, 2010 @ 9:51 pm
Mark Brown, I’m not sure what you mean by me being wrong about you; as you slandered pretty much everyone to the left of Rush Limbaugh. If I misunderstand (which is always more than possible) please give me more information, if you like.
oh, Mark Brown, I’m willing to publically admit that I could quite possibly have misunderstand youl I so, please forgive me.
However, unfortunately, my life has not consisted of gaily leaping from flower to flower, lapping up the nectar contained within, though for longer than was appropriate I thought it was, to the endless detriment of not only me buf of my poor offspring.
Not not not not not not not your problem. But, i’ve lost at last some of my innocence. So, some proof, please.
personally I thought Saddam Hussein was just the type of guy to run that particular country Djinn. Kurds, they were with the Iranians, bigger jerks than Saddam. Kuwait, bunch of jerks there too. Iraq invades Kuwait, big deal there, guess who has to fix it. US. Sanctions for like 12 years whole bunch of kids die. Bad situation all around… http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_sanctions since wikipedia is cool for sources here… So.. what do we do, Saddams all pissed at us and if we keep on with the sanctions well bunch of kids are gonna die, if we lift the sanctions well he’s probably gonna get all crazy again. Shiites well theyre buddies with the Iranians big reason why we liked Saddam over the Iranians in the first place… Kurds, too unpredictable… Sunnis can’t take Saddam out without pissing them off… It’s been an F’d up situation since the British drew up the boundaries to make that POS country. F’it. Should have just let Saddam take Kuwait, but no we had to “do the right thing” with a lot of poking and prodding form a bunch of other countries that wanted to “do the right thing” as long as we do most of the work. Then we get some jerk named Osama Bin Laden who’s butt hurt because the King of Saudi didn’t want his help and instead preferred the US military, now this jerk is all over our S and even says the sanctions are part of why he has a problem. F*** the middle east.
Comment by SUNNofaB.C.Rich — February 11, 2010 @ 11:59 pm
djinn, just so you know.
I think you are a good person, and I’m quite certain I would like you if we ever met in person. And I hope that you would like me back.
My purpose in even commenting was to say that I think paranoia and extremism are fairly evenly distributed across the political spectrum. That’s all. I don’t mind if you disagree, since I think you’re kinda cool.
Peace.
Comment by Mark Brown — February 12, 2010 @ 10:44 am
I agree with #183… we can do nothing right by the middle east, the whole world should have probably just left them to themselves back in the day. Unfortunately, it didn’t. Now the whole world is in a catch 22 with regards to them.
I get really tired of people calling each other bigoted/racist/stupid/crazy. Being passive aggressive about it doesn’t make it go away. Please stop. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions.
and try not to anger the server gods.
Comment by mfranti — February 9, 2010 @ 11:35 am
Oh, thank goodness. I thought the Church patriarchy Danites had gotten to the site!
Comment by Ms. Jack Meyers — February 9, 2010 @ 11:39 am
Oh YAY! I was going through serious withdrawals
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 11:41 am
Way to go, server techs!
Comment by Derek — February 9, 2010 @ 11:49 am
It seems a few threads and posts are missing. Is that purposeful?
Comment by ESO — February 9, 2010 @ 12:01 pm
hurray!!!!
Comment by Georgy — February 9, 2010 @ 12:09 pm
Yay!
Comment by Chelsea — February 9, 2010 @ 12:13 pm
Hallelujah!
Comment by Moniker Challenged — February 9, 2010 @ 12:13 pm
Which ones have you noticed ESO?
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 12:19 pm
I’m weeping tears of actual joy. And I think I just did a cartwheel. Which is weird considering I’ve never been able to do one before.
Comment by Risa — February 9, 2010 @ 12:22 pm
The gladiatorial match between replenishers and self-reliancers has been tidily swept away.
Comment by Moniker Challenged — February 9, 2010 @ 12:25 pm
I think that statement would be more poetic if I said tidally swept away.
Comment by Moniker Challenged — February 9, 2010 @ 12:25 pm
Every accounted for? Did we leave anybody back at the last gas station?
It is a great day.
Comment by Mary Magdalene — February 9, 2010 @ 12:29 pm
Mary Magdalene, I’ve been wondering about you. Good to see you!
Comment by Stephanie — February 9, 2010 @ 12:33 pm
And now, I am once again at peace with the universe.
Oh dear, I missed my fmh!
Comment by Enna — February 9, 2010 @ 12:37 pm
as if my place wasn’t good enough! harupmffff…
Comment by mfranti — February 9, 2010 @ 12:43 pm
Does this mean I can stop my sacrifices to the server gods?
I am glad this wasn’t an object lesson on the Lord giving and taking away. I appreciated the chance to check out some of your blogs and came away with all kinds of self-improvement projects. Peripheral inspiration, pretty cool!
Comment by Lupita — February 9, 2010 @ 12:48 pm
Mary> Your comment made me laugh. My husband’s parents had 6 kids who used to tease them on road trips by saying “Mom, Dad! We forgot ______” only to have said so-and-so pop up 2 minutes later from under the seat (no seatbelts in those days). This never-cry-wolf game resulted eventually in my husband being left behind at a gas station at a tender age for a couple of hours. It took the kids a while to convince their parents that they really had forgotten him.
For his part, hubby found 5 dollars on the ground, bought himself some ice cream and sat on the curb to wait. LOL
Comment by xenologue — February 9, 2010 @ 12:51 pm
Good enough? Man, I’m getting my bike tuned up, thanks to you. If I’d read any further, maybe I’d be putting in a chicken coop this weekend!
Comment by Lupita — February 9, 2010 @ 12:53 pm
Thanks, Pita.
I don’t do much with that blog thing. I’m glad I inspired you.
Comment by mfranti — February 9, 2010 @ 12:57 pm
Methadone Mel to the RESCUE!!!! I like your place…. it’s nice
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 1:00 pm
Whew, so good to say hi to Mary Magdalene! I’ve missed your comments!
Comment by meems — February 9, 2010 @ 1:06 pm
I missed FMH, but it was great to peek around at other blogs! But I think even my husband noticed my withdrawal…
I really would like to continue “Walk a mile in my shoes” with one question - Where do people draw the imaginary line between benefits of society that are considered ok and good, like roads, police, fire, schools, universities (which are heavily tax-payer subsidized in many cases) and what they consider bad, and call welfare, from TANF to WIC. Plus, the difference between our parent’s and grandparents generation and ourselves (in self-sufficiency being possible on one income, or two even, then versus now) But if it is lost in the internet graveyard… I will pout on my own.
Comment by SarahJane — February 9, 2010 @ 1:14 pm
So glad to see you’re back!!
Comment by RoseM — February 9, 2010 @ 1:14 pm
Thank goodness!
Comment by Cindy — February 9, 2010 @ 1:16 pm
Brave SarahJane, taunting the server gods!!
Comment by Lupita — February 9, 2010 @ 1:17 pm
Danke to my many loved friends here at fmh.
There are no good excuses. Just sometimes, I need a break and the plate in front of my gets awfully awfully full.. and then overflows… and now the table cloth needs spot remover, etc.
You’ll be happy to know we’ve weathered re-entry of a missionary, sent one back to school, sent one to school (the cost of two college freshman - ouch!), we still have two in high school here and we’ve reduced our foot print down to two continents.
In the meantime, I’ve hit the 1/3 completed mark of graduate school, my research article was finally published (1st author - whee!), and we threw in a Christmas trip that was Paris, London, Brussels (for 6) - just for good measure.
Somehow I managed to stay mostly current on my lil personal blog.
Thank Jesus for Diet Coke, good husbands, bright capable women, and sobriety.
I haven’t had to plan to a homocide or a suicide in a very long time. That makes this a most outstanding Tuesday.
Comment by Mary Magdalene — February 9, 2010 @ 1:20 pm
Mary Magdalene, you’ve been sorely missed and always make me smile
Comment by Enna — February 9, 2010 @ 1:23 pm
I’m so glad fMh is back!!!!!!!!! Where is “Walk a Mile…”? I was LOVING that thread…
Comment by Lawyer Lady — February 9, 2010 @ 1:46 pm
i don’t know where it is. perhaps it’s the reason the server crashed.
Comment by mfranti — February 9, 2010 @ 1:47 pm
Haha. I don’t think we terribly need it to come back.
But wasn’t there one other post right before it, and after the Suffragette one? I guess only the server gods will ever know.
WELCOME BACK!!! YIPPEE!!
Comment by Natalie K. — February 9, 2010 @ 1:59 pm
natalie,
shameless!
Comment by mfranti — February 9, 2010 @ 2:00 pm
Oh, I’m way too excited to have any shame.
Comment by Natalie K. — February 9, 2010 @ 2:01 pm
I haven’t emailed janine yet but if anyone else is fre for a bay area snackr this saturday drop me a line: sarasbreaadco at gmail.com
Comment by crazywomancreek — February 9, 2010 @ 2:15 pm
argh sarasbreadco at gmail
Comment by crazywomancreek — February 9, 2010 @ 2:15 pm
Horray!!
Welcome back, FMHers.
Comment by Kaimi — February 9, 2010 @ 2:18 pm
awwww ya, there were two posts that had lively discussions on them
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 2:18 pm
you mean this post?
What other post is missing? I’m so confused.
Comment by mfranti — February 9, 2010 @ 2:26 pm
Sister Suffragettes and the Walk a Mile in My Shoes one.
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 2:28 pm
GAH… ok… I’m having major brain farts today apparently
Must. Get. Nap.
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 2:29 pm
It was the one I wrote on Valentine’s Day ideas called “A Feminist Valentine’s Day”.
Comment by Stephanie — February 9, 2010 @ 2:49 pm
Ah, yes, that was it!
Comment by Natalie K. — February 9, 2010 @ 2:51 pm
Mary Magdelene- good to see ya…I’m feeling your pain around the two college students. Congrats on the paper. Can we see it somewhere?
Comment by Kimberly — February 9, 2010 @ 3:05 pm
#16 - mfranti - I imagined you said “harumphhh” just like Kerry Jackson on RFH. And your place is totally good enough! For some reason I felt the freedom to be a lot sillier on your blog than on this one. Weird.
Comment by Risa — February 9, 2010 @ 3:08 pm
harumphhh! harumphhh! harumphhh! harumphhh!
indeed i was. but i believe mel brooks should get the credit.
i wonder what would happen if i posted that poll over here? firestorm?
..and i told you my place was cozy.
Comment by mfranti — February 9, 2010 @ 3:19 pm
Oh, goodie! I’m glad to see you all back up.
Comment by Ziff — February 9, 2010 @ 3:21 pm
Since we’re not talking about anything particularly pointed, may I use this opportunity to ask if anyone had any ideas about how to get a UT valleyish snacker together while Bridget Jack Meyers is here in (I think) April? I
Comment by Moniker Challenged — February 9, 2010 @ 3:40 pm
let’s make it a salt lake area snacker. I’ve been meaning to get something going but haven’t.
Who’s up for a Utah snacker?
Comment by mfranti — February 9, 2010 @ 3:43 pm
I’m glad fMh is back up and I’m glad to know it was a server issue.
Comment by Karen — February 9, 2010 @ 3:46 pm
I so hope you don’t post that poll over here, mel. I hate having to admit that I am Republican (as evidenced by the fact that I am going to vote in the Republican Primary for Texas Governor, I suppose) when I read things like that.
Comment by Stephanie — February 9, 2010 @ 3:47 pm
I’m up for a Utah snacker! I’d love to meet everyone IRL.
And Mel, your place is cozy. I was even donning my fuzzy slippers and bathroom while I was there
Comment by Risa — February 9, 2010 @ 3:48 pm
er, bathROBE. It’s hard to don a bathroom. They’re too heavy with all the porcelain and cultured marble.
Comment by Risa — February 9, 2010 @ 3:49 pm
Stephanie, I’ve voted for Republicans before. There’s no shame in being a good one.
but yah, I can see why you might want to distance yourself from the people in that poll.
I would.
Comment by mfranti — February 9, 2010 @ 3:49 pm
ps
are you saying that you don’t attend tea party protests?
Comment by mfranti — February 9, 2010 @ 3:50 pm
CWC: A Bay area snacker? The ONE weekend I’m going to be out of Town!
Comment by Mike H. — February 9, 2010 @ 3:52 pm
I never have.
Comment by Stephanie — February 9, 2010 @ 3:56 pm
What happened to the welfare article?
Comment by StillConfused — February 9, 2010 @ 4:03 pm
Lupita, you are in rare form today. LOL!!!
CWC, I’d love to get together. Maybe we can brain storm for the greater CLP get together I am working on that we will make sure Mike can come to.
At least the snacker part.
Comment by jeannine — February 9, 2010 @ 4:03 pm
Stephanie, there’s no shame as long as it’s a vote for Medina
Comment by Enna — February 9, 2010 @ 4:13 pm
That’s right, Enna!
Comment by Stephanie — February 9, 2010 @ 4:21 pm
Stephanie, as a frothing at the mouth liberal (but the froth always matches my shawl) that disagrees with you on pretty much every issue, You’re the loyal opposition. Or, perhaps it’s me.
The problem isn’t being Republican, it’s being one of those people who incorrectly call themselves Republicans who think those truly scary things that mfranti’s poll showed. You know, thinking Obama wants the Terrorists to win (???????) and that Acorn (an organization with almost no power) somehow threw the election to Obama. I’m calling them Palinistas.
Comment by djinn — February 9, 2010 @ 4:27 pm
Ummm SLC might be in range… I have family down there so It may be doable….
SE Idaho here… but there will NEVER be a snacker here due to rabid redstate tendencies. Maybe I can get a carpool going or something.
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 4:32 pm
ha! djinn - I have met a few repubs that think those things from the poll. but I think they have mental problems. No -seriously, nut job types with paranoid delusions. I’m not a republican, though… not after living in Utah for a little while…
Comment by SarahJane — February 9, 2010 @ 4:32 pm
Wait, what?!
There are plans for a non-Seattle snacker?!
NUH UH!!!!
Seattle. That’s it, Mel, I’m submitting something.
Comment by Natalie K. — February 9, 2010 @ 4:33 pm
Yes to a Utah snacker! and I want to meet Bridget Jack Meyers!
And YAY! to getting the server fixed!!
Comment by Theolina — February 9, 2010 @ 4:34 pm
Now for either a moment of rare candor, or a common moment of toomuchinformation (the others of which I have blissfully forgotten)–I’m pretty much housebound due to all the usual suspects; hanging out here is for me what passes to hanging out with friends. I’m extremely social, even in my rather exaggeratedly muted state; sorry for all the drama, mostly.
Comment by djinn — February 9, 2010 @ 4:35 pm
And April is my birthday… IMAGINE THAT!
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 4:35 pm
in case you’re wondering what they’re talking about up there.
do not follow the link unless you want to be scared.
Comment by mfranti — February 9, 2010 @ 4:35 pm
Between “frothing at the mouth liberal” and “rabid redstate tendencies” … sounds like FMH is either behind on its immunizations or in need of a fresh 52oz ice cold fountain diet coke.
I’m gonna err on the side of caution and suggest a diet coke. If tomorrow, someone else is showing symptoms, we’ll just line up in the cafeteria and roll up our left sleeves - we can kick it old school.
It’s still a great Tuesday … even though there isn’t much left of it. Make it a good one sisters and brothers!
Comment by Mary Magdalene — February 9, 2010 @ 4:37 pm
“A cool name, given to a girl. Appears to contain the magical property of forcing others to ask the same question when it is first heard, regardless of good sense.
‘Hey, what’s your name?’
‘April.’
‘Oh, so were you born in April?’
‘Shut up.’ “
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 4:38 pm
mmmm ice cold coke…. ya, that would do it.
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 4:41 pm
Or scarred Mfranti…. in the case that they ARE Republicans.
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 4:42 pm
April, #70…. Haha.
Comment by Natalie K. — February 9, 2010 @ 4:42 pm
My dad’s a tea party conservative- he went to his first demonstration/protest ever last year. I told him not to get himself arrested like all those hippies he used to go on and on about in the 70’s… Anyhoo, whatever the cause, I like to see people demonstrating when they are passionate about something. It’s apathy that’s gonna get us in the end…not demonstrations.
Comment by Kimberly — February 9, 2010 @ 4:44 pm
I happen to agree fully Kimberly! Though I have issues with some of the things about the Tea Parties I tend to believe that it is mostly normal people that are just tired of the “politics as usual” and need to stand up and be heard.
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 4:52 pm
If you see a throng, go protest in it. Probably can’t hurt nothin’
Comment by Moniker Challenged — February 9, 2010 @ 4:53 pm
I’m game for a Utah snacker and will drag Eris along with me.
It’s good to be back here.
Comment by numi — February 9, 2010 @ 4:54 pm
Moniker C - I just can’t hardly help myself tonight …..but, if I see a thong I promise not to protest in IT.
Somebody has a case of the giggles.. and when I say ’somebody’ .. I mean me.
Comment by Mary Magdalene — February 9, 2010 @ 4:56 pm
…especially in january with this bod.
yuk
Comment by mfranti — February 9, 2010 @ 4:58 pm
that reminds me of the thong song.
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 5:00 pm
I could not disagree more Kimberly. The tea party ‘conservatives’ give me true terrors. They are wrong. You know they are wrong. That sort of wrong has led to quite a number of atrocities in the last century, I’ll forgo mentioning the most obvious one.
It’s bad for people to be so misinformed in such a way that undermines our democracy.
Comment by djinn — February 9, 2010 @ 5:04 pm
Poor choice of words, especially in a conversation about tea- um partiers.
Comment by Moniker Challenged — February 9, 2010 @ 5:06 pm
I disagree with your politics, Kimberly, you disagree with mine. FIne; this is what democracy is all about. However, we both understand the sky is blue.
Teabaggers, not so much. What can you say except “Your version of reality does not intersect the actual world.” Scary. Scary. Scary.
Comment by djinn — February 9, 2010 @ 5:06 pm
Speaking of misinformation, I’ve got an over-ripe Glenn Beck dvd I received for Christmas here. If Deseret Book won’t exchange it for candy, I’d be willing to donate it to UT snacker festivities.
Comment by Moniker Challenged — February 9, 2010 @ 5:08 pm
jeannine, you are too kind.
But MM, I think everyone protesting should keep their thongs on. Otherwise the hippy factor increases exponentially.
Comment by Lupita — February 9, 2010 @ 5:10 pm
Although I lament dragging down the light-hearted, thong-themed tone, I have to agree with djinn here.
I think it is decidedly NOT better for people to be agitating for a certain position instead of being apathetic. The positions held by the Tea Party Convention are damaging, and have hurt a great deal of people the world over. Adding to their numbers by attending protests only helps legitimize their points of view, and cause further harm.
Unless maybe you went in a thong.
That could be fighting the good fight.
Comment by Natalie K. — February 9, 2010 @ 5:11 pm
Moniker Challenged: and what are we supposed to do with a Glenn Beck CD? That would certainly ruin the snacker for me. Unless of course….. oh, never mind…. that thought was bad….
Comment by numi — February 9, 2010 @ 5:12 pm
I like hippies. And I doubt a hippie would wear a thong.
Comment by numi — February 9, 2010 @ 5:13 pm
Keep pushing for Seattle, Natalie K.!
Comment by ErinAnn — February 9, 2010 @ 5:14 pm
Some one could re-gift it, or melt it in the microwave, or use it to keep swallows from building under their eves? I didn’t mean it was necessarily for diligent study. I’m just trying to recycle, reduce, and re-use here.
Comment by Moniker Challenged — February 9, 2010 @ 5:14 pm
I guess this is as good a thread as any to announce that I’m officially changing my tag, due to the overabundance of various forms of Natalie on the bloggernacle.
So hi everyone. I’m Hammie now.
Comment by Hammie (formerly known as Natalie K.) — February 9, 2010 @ 5:18 pm
I don’t dislike anyone enough to re-gift it and I would rather have swallows in my eaves than that CD hanging around my house where someone could see it. The microwave is a real possibility.
Comment by numi — February 9, 2010 @ 5:20 pm
“And I doubt a hippie would wear a thong.”
That was my point
Comment by Lupita — February 9, 2010 @ 5:21 pm
Have you ever put a CD in a microwave?
Very, very cool. Like homemade lightning.
Don’t tell my mom.
Comment by Hammie (formerly known as Natalie K.) — February 9, 2010 @ 5:22 pm
All bets are off. They’ll give me $19.95 in candy purchase power. I’m afraid me selfish desire for sweeties is overriding my altruistic desire to not unleash this evil on the world.
Comment by Moniker Challenged — February 9, 2010 @ 5:27 pm
Good choice.
Comment by numi — February 9, 2010 @ 5:30 pm
So, the answer is yes, I’ll sell my brothers and sisters to the White Witch for Turkish Delight. But I will not wear a thong.
Comment by Moniker Challenged — February 9, 2010 @ 5:30 pm
Hammie the hyper squirrel? Awesome Nataliek!
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 5:33 pm
Lol. Actually, Hammie based on the childhood nickname I had because of my maiden name (Hamilton), but I’m kinda like a hyper squirrel, so that’s good too.
Comment by Hammie (formerly known as Natalie K.) — February 9, 2010 @ 5:34 pm
hehe… if you give you caffeine will the world go into slow mo for you?
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 5:37 pm
I’m sending you Redbulls for some random holiday.
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 5:38 pm
Moniker C.: Maybe make that G. Beck DVD can be added to those CD collages, like the AOL ones in that ad.
Wasn’t the USSR a “Red State?”
April: Were you close to being named “May”?
Comment by Mike H. — February 9, 2010 @ 5:39 pm
ummm my birthday is close to May… but I wonder if the prospect of naming a little girl May would have zapped my parents out of their apathetic state enough to name me something else
They were (after all) sure, SURE I was going to be a boy. lol
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 5:44 pm
Welcome back! I knew you’d make it work sooner or later. Nice blog mfranti.
Rather than be scared by those statistics, I suspected they were cooked a bit. That’s not like Republicans I know, at least not in those numbers.
Comment by Mommie Dearest — February 9, 2010 @ 5:52 pm
That’s a good point, Mommie Dearest. It’s not like most Republicans I know either - a handful, maybe - but definitely not most.
Comment by Stephanie — February 9, 2010 @ 5:55 pm
I’ll third that Stephanie. And I know a LOT of Republicans….
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 5:58 pm
can i just state the obvious with regard to the poll…
it was performed by a non partisan pollster and it was anonymous.
how many upstanding christians do you know would come right out and admit to some of the questions in that poll in typical setting?
not many for fear they might come off as looking bad (read: kinda lame)
i also want to clarify that the poll was to guage republican stereotypes. hence, the nature of the questions.
at least, that’s my analysis.
what would a democratic stereotype poll look like?
have at it!
Comment by mfranti — February 9, 2010 @ 5:59 pm
hmmm if I went by my childhood nickname I have a feeling people would be offended.
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 6:00 pm
Hmmm well while the company is considered non-partisan the poll was made to Kos’s specifics…. So likely the nature of the questions COULD lean one way or another…
Hmmmm democratic stereotype?
“Do you think George Bush should currently be in prison, yes or no?”
“Do you think Cheney is the anti-Christ? Yes or no?”
“Do you agree with redistributing wealth? Yes or no?”
“Do you think all Republicans are evil? Yes or no?”
“Do you believe that all illegal immigrants should be granted citizenship? Yes or no?”
I’m sure I could probably think of more…
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 6:11 pm
Yeah! I’d wondered where you guys went.
Comment by kristine N — February 9, 2010 @ 6:11 pm
April, to answer your questions:
Yes.
No.
YES!
No.
Yes.
Comment by Hammie (formerly known as Natalie K.) — February 9, 2010 @ 6:15 pm
My parents think George W. Bush is the anti-Christ, but then they’re not religious, so… I guess I don’t really know what they mean by that.
Comment by Kimarie — February 9, 2010 @ 6:23 pm
Would you skimp on personal hygiene to save resources? Y or N?
Do you enjoy food stuffs made of mixed grains, nuts, and dried fruit? Y or N?
Do you own sustainably-harvest cork shoes? Y or N?
Would you consider substituting dead babies for nuts in your cereal mixture? Y or N?
Comment by Moniker Challenged — February 9, 2010 @ 6:29 pm
what would a democratic stereotype poll look like?
mfranti, that’s an easy one.
At least one third of self-identified liberal people believe all of the following, as multiple polls attest :
- George W. Bush intentionally caused 9/11. What can you even say to that, except welcome to the nuthouse?
- Iraqi civilian casualties exceeded 5 million deaths (real number = 125,000 - 175,000). That’s still a lot, but the continual and outrageous exaggeration of civilian casualties demonstrates how detached some of us are from reality.
- George W. Bush stole the election from Al W. Gore. This continues to be repeated, in spite of a thorough debunking of the idea by the NY Times.
The nuts are all over the political map. The poll you posted is scary, but no more scary than usual.
Comment by Mark Brown — February 9, 2010 @ 6:32 pm
LOL How about this.
“Do you think American Military presence in other countries is bad? Yes or no”
“Do you think the majority of the American Populace is ignorant? Yes or no”
“Do you think the news media has a right to withhold information from the public because it is deemed ‘too complex’ for the public to understand? Yes or no”
“Do you think the government should dictate what is “right” despite what the general populace seems to think? Yes or no?”
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 6:35 pm
Good point Mark -
“Do you think George Bush intentionally caused 9/11? Yes or no?”
“Do you think George Bush stole the election from Al Gore? yes or no?”
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 6:38 pm
Rofl Moniker Challenged lol Those are great!
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 6:40 pm
Really, I’d just like an all out poll of how many people believe ANY conspiracy theory. That would be interesting.
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 6:42 pm
oooo here’s one.
“Do you think Homeschooling should be outlawed? Yes or no?”
that would be interesting from either party.
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 6:44 pm
Wow… I will stop with the keyboard vomit all over the post… kk?
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 6:44 pm
is home-schooling considered self-reliant?
Comment by SarahJane — February 9, 2010 @ 7:05 pm
No, it’s just my impression that many feel that by allowing home school they are allowing “fundamentalists” to teach their children bigotry etc. Also it allows parents to have their own curriculum, including things that are not allowed in public schools.
As a disclaimer I have nothing against homeschooling and think it works wonderfully for some children.
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 7:09 pm
I don’t know if it’s considered self-reliant…. and if it is, by whom. Not really knowledgeable on it actually. Just have a couple of friends who are VERY defensive about it who are Republicans.
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 7:11 pm
Hi ya’ll so nice to see everyone! I just had a crazy volunteer at school day and now I have an hour to write a little talk for the meetingformerlyknownasenrichment so no time to hang out. But tomorrow I should be able to hand out a bit! Yay, the blog is back!
Comment by fMhLisa — February 9, 2010 @ 7:19 pm
Mark, did you hear that This American Life about the casualty numbers? You should look it up, sooooo interesting. I’ll find a link after the writing a talk pressure is off.
Comment by fMhLisa — February 9, 2010 @ 7:21 pm
lisa,
you have to show me how to put up a poll because i really want to do a democrat stereotype poll. it will be the most accurate poll ever.
Comment by mfranti — February 9, 2010 @ 7:24 pm
I’m sad to see my post gone, I didn’t get to read the last hundred comments or so, but then again, maybe that’s for the best…
Glad you are up and running again!
Comment by Cecile — February 9, 2010 @ 7:40 pm
Lisa,
My source isn’t This American Life, but it is NPR.
Comment by Mark Brown — February 9, 2010 @ 7:48 pm
did you save it Cecile? I would love to read it again and keep discussing it. I think it is central to our political problems currently, the ways we view the government and helping our fellow Americans.
Comment by SarahJane — February 9, 2010 @ 7:53 pm
I thought about reposting it….
should i?
next 10 comments decide.
Comment by mfranti — February 9, 2010 @ 7:54 pm
Yes, please. Great topic for FMH.
Comment by SarahJane — February 9, 2010 @ 7:56 pm
thank you thank you!
Comment by cchrissyy — February 9, 2010 @ 8:05 pm
wait! i just followed a link from my reader
LOOK here it is
Comment by mfranti — February 9, 2010 @ 8:07 pm
but no comments. that’s some weird stuff going on.
Comment by mfranti — February 9, 2010 @ 8:08 pm
April, I have a friend named July (pronounced Julie), who was born in July. She has a sister also named after her birth month, but I can’t remember which month it is.
I’d be up for a Salt Lake snacker, as long as my freak random shyness didn’t prevent me from coming.
Comment by Alliegator — February 9, 2010 @ 8:09 pm
tried to access it, says that nothing is there…
Comment by SarahJane — February 9, 2010 @ 8:24 pm
From Hammie (formerly known as Natalie K) in 86:
Ok, this is an honest question. I’m not trying to argue or be rhetorical (did I spell that right?).
What is it that the Tea Party people do/believe that is so hurtful? I thought they were a movement promoting fiscal responsibility and small government. In your opinion is that was causes harm to people all over the world or is there something I’m missing?
Comment by Theolina — February 9, 2010 @ 8:34 pm
Repost it! I didn’t see it before the server crashed, and I’d like to. And yours must be cached, mfranti, because that link doesn’t pull up anything for me.
Comment by Vada — February 9, 2010 @ 8:39 pm
When I found you were back up this morning, I felt a large amount of previously unacknowledged tension leave my body.
And Alligator #135….I didn’t comment this morning because I didn’t want my comment to be too public…how’s that for freak random shyness:)
So, me too for the Utah snacker….maybe.
Comment by TA — February 9, 2010 @ 8:40 pm
Theolina… I kinda want to know the answer to that too actually. I don’t think being financially responsible is bad, be in individually or for a government.
I would like to see the pose back mfranti.
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 8:43 pm
I’m up for a SLC Snacker.
Comment by Derek — February 9, 2010 @ 8:44 pm
Strike a POSE! I ment post
Comment by April — February 9, 2010 @ 8:52 pm
Mark Brown, call for references. You said:
First point–Bush causing 9-11. Wha? Huh? What? Provide references that some percentage of liberals believe this or I’m writing it off as simply false.
2nd point: Iraq war casualties. Provide proof that those scary liberals belive that they’re in the 5 Million mark, because, I have never heard such a number used. Two peer-reviewed surveys have been performed, and provide much higher death rates than you give.
Using peer-reviewd studies only, in Iraq, around 655,000 to 1.2 Million excess people died because of our invasion, depending upon which peer reviewed suryey you quote.
I am (sadly) aware that the perfectly fine Lancet survey (655.000 deaths) was attacked with quite the venom by statistically-innocent pundits. The 2nd peer-review study, the ORB account, which gave the higher number of 1.2 million, escaped such vehemence, even from the US right. I guess they couldn’t find anything to complain about.
Many people died. Many more, like ten times more, than you admit, Mark Brown. Eveif you don’t like it, Mark Brown. The point here is that “liberals” believe that somewhere between a half million and 1.2 million excess people died because the US attacted Iraq. This belief is true.
Now, on to the election of George Bush.
The Supreme Court handed the election to George Bush, and knew it, as their reasoning was so specious they refused to allow the opinion to be used as future precedence.
Justice Stevens, an actual Supreme Court justice, had the following to say about the majority opinion:
.
If a member of the Supreme Court of the United States is that furious about the Bush v. Gore opinion, than an everyday citizen can hold a similar opinion without being thought as anything but a responsible citizen. \
Compare this with the number of Americans who think Obama is in league with the terrorists. What are they talking about? What evidence do they have? Where do they buy the tinfoil from which they fashion their shiny hats?
See the difference? One side has facts. The other side has paranoid fact-free fantasies.
Comment by djinn — February 9, 2010 @ 9:02 pm
I actually got scared that you started blocking the site to foreign IP addresses (the way Hulu.com and NBC.com do, so I can’t watch any of my shows here in Tokyo).
I wonder, are there are any other fmh readers in Tokyo? I’m Catholic, not LDS, so haven’t had many opportunities to find out — but would love to have a “Far East snacker.” (Or maybe I am the only one, in which case, I would get to eat all the snacks myself).
Comment by L. — February 9, 2010 @ 9:03 pm
As per the inestimable Jack’s comment way way way back up at comment #2. The Danites were also called “The Daughters of Zion.” I’m totally signing up (for my favorite issues, only). 19th century Mormon gender-bending. Too cool.
Comment by djinn — February 9, 2010 @ 9:18 pm
djinn,
Election question:
http://www.nytimes.com/2001/11/12/politics/12VOTE.html
“Study of Disputed Florida Ballots Finds Justices Did Not Cast the Deciding Vote”
9/11 question:
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/current_events/bush_administration/22_believe_bush_knew_about_9_11_attacks_in_advance
I guess we could argue about the difference between causing 9/11 (my words) and knowing about it in advance and doing nothing to stop it. But I don’t think there is a moral difference. Anyway, it’s worse than I thought. Fully 61% of Democrats either believed it or at least thought it might be true. Like I said before, welcome to the nuthouse.
As to Iraqi casualties, I’m going with the WHO. They had 1000 samples, Lancet only had 47. The study with 20 times as much data is very likely to be the more accurate study. You can disagree, and that’s fine. But please spare me all the talk about one side having all the facts and the other side dealing in fact free fantasies. There’s plenty of ignorance and fear to go around, as your comment amply demonstrates.
Comment by Mark Brown — February 9, 2010 @ 9:27 pm
And after Lancet’s latest retraction of its bogus study which purported to show that childhood inoculations cause autism, I am astonished — absolutely dumbfounded — that anybody takes them seriously anymore. They literally just make stuff up and peddle it gullible, paranoid people.
Comment by Mark Brown — February 9, 2010 @ 9:31 pm
aw L.! I was in seoul til just a couple of months ago. im back in the US now, but it’s nice to know i wasn’t the only FMHer in or near the land of the rising sun!
Comment by nobodyputsbabyinacorner — February 9, 2010 @ 9:41 pm
we could have had those crunchy salty fish things for snacks, or the gooby things filled with mugwort. mmm.
Comment by nobodyputsbabyinacorner — February 9, 2010 @ 9:42 pm
I am only in town for the weekend so who wants to name a park? I’ll be there, Noodle, Lynette from ZD, Jeanine, Chandelle (yes, I read that as confirmation, Chandelle) and who else?
We’ll picnic, we’ll cavort, we’ll bless our daughters in the ocean. Well, some of that.
Name a time and park, someone who knows the city!
Oh and I may bring my charming, handsome, single non-LDS BFF - you are all welcome to “flirt to convert.”
I’d love to see him married to a nice Mormon feminist
Comment by crazywomancreek — February 9, 2010 @ 10:03 pm
Hey! If there’s a Utah snacker, I can make it on a weekend - or even a Friday later afternoon. I’m in Boise for the semester, but will drive down to meet and greet. Especially if Jack is in town.
Comment by that1girl — February 9, 2010 @ 11:02 pm
I think I had a terribly thought provoking and deep comment to one of these posts that got lost in the thing that happened. It was a real mind blower too.
Comment by SUNNofaB.C.Rich — February 9, 2010 @ 11:11 pm
48-
I would love another Utah snacker! And so would my husband! My 3-year-old still talks about the last one occasionally.
Comment by ifrit — February 9, 2010 @ 11:14 pm
Mark Brown, once it had been shown that Andrew Wakefield faked his “vaccines cause autism results,” Lancet behaved properly and renounced the study. That’s how science works, and makes Lancet more, not less reliable. There were somewhere between 600+ thousand and over a million excess deaths in Iraq due to the Iraq war. I noticed you haven’t bothered to dispute the ORB study; as far as I can tell it’s indisputible, but I’m open to evidence showing otherwise.
As to the Bush/Gore presidential election thing, it was a close call according to any study. But take a gander at how statewide recounts pretty much universally would have given the election to Gore. The one that didn’t invade Iraq on totally made-up evidence.
(From WIkipedia)
Review of all ballots statewide (never undertaken)
• Standard as set by each county canvassing board during their survey Gore by 171
• Fully punched chad and limited marks on optical ballots Gore by 115
• Any dimples or optical mark Gore by 107
• One corner of chad detached or optical mark Gore by 60
Gore wins them all.
I’m horrified by the Rasmussen study you cited that showed that 33% of Democrats believed that Bush had something to do with 9-11, so I’ll give you that one. Totally creepy. Ugh. Ugh. Ugh.
Both sides have faults. BUt your side is worse. And listenes to totally lame music.
So, none of this calling Obama a terrorist-lover, OK? It’s just not true, and I worry about his survival. For reals.
:
Comment by djinn — February 9, 2010 @ 11:48 pm
The remark “But your side is worse. And listenes to totally lame music.” was my attempt at lightening the conversation by saying something obviously false and unsupportable. But my sense of humor is somewhat obscure. So there is the remains of my joke. like a patient etherized upon a table.
Comment by djinn — February 9, 2010 @ 11:54 pm
oh you’re coming and going, sweet djinn
michealangelo or no…
Comment by crazywomancreek — February 9, 2010 @ 11:58 pm
To give up all attempts at originality, sweet cwc
We have lingered in the chambers of the sea
By sea-girls wreathed with seaweed red and brown
Till human voices wake us, and we drown.
Comment by djinn — February 10, 2010 @ 12:03 am
I’m trying to think of a place that could work in any weather…thinking thinking thinking….
how old is your bff? (just curious, of course.)
Comment by jeannine — February 10, 2010 @ 12:29 am
36 yrs old and so smart!
Comment by crazywomancreek — February 10, 2010 @ 12:33 am
Also, not to seem even more crass than is my due. Thank you thank you thank you FMH for being back up; and thank you thank you thank you commmenters for giving me something to comment about. Thanks. <3
Comment by djinn — February 10, 2010 @ 12:58 am
Hooray! Congratulations on your return.
Comment by ZD Eve — February 10, 2010 @ 1:03 am
Lynnette, do you just travel the globe attending snackers? Can I sign up?
Comment by Enna — February 10, 2010 @ 10:08 am
djinn (154)
Disagree re: Lancet. Their research on the topic of vaccines and autism has been under fire for years. It is incredible that it took them this long to retract.
I noticed you haven’t bothered to dispute the ORB study; as far as I can tell it’s indisputible, but I’m open to evidence showing otherwise.
I think the burden of proof is on you to explain why you think the ORB study is accurate. Lancet, ORB and WHO all used the same research methodology, so the methods are not in dispute. ORB sampled in 15 sectors, Lancet in 47, and WHO in 1,000. Common sense would tell us that the largest sample size is very, very likely to be more accurate. Can you explain why you do not think that?
The Wiki article you cite refutes rather than confirms your statement. The part you cite notes that it is the outcome of only one study and that clarification is needed. The rest of the article supports my position, to wit:
The results of the study showed that had the limited county by county recounts requested by the Gore team been completed, Bush would still have been the winner of the election.
and
The media recount study found that under the system of limited recounts in selected counties as was requested by the Gore campaign, the only way that Gore would have won was by using counting methods that were never requested by any party
Agreed. But you probably ought to be a little more careful with your assumptions about which side I am on.
Comment by Mark Brown — February 10, 2010 @ 10:56 am
I just wanna brag and tell you that Quimby stopped by and commented on the fmh thread at my blog yesterday.
she’s well. i talk to her often.
Comment by mfranti — February 10, 2010 @ 12:00 pm
ahh we’re back, we’ve ignorantly insulted homeschoolers and republicans and assumed that any opinion we like is reasonable as long as ONE supreme court justice agrees.
how long were we gone?
ahh feminism… pro (our kinds of) choice
Comment by britt — February 10, 2010 @ 2:04 pm
who insulted home-schoolers?
as for republicans…well, did you see the poll? i think it’s ok to discuss the poll.
and to be fair, I asked what a democrat stereotype poll would look like so take a stab at it.
Comment by mfranti — February 10, 2010 @ 2:08 pm
I think it’s Aprils thrown out there comments theorizing why some people might be against homeschool-then balancing it out by saying it might work for some children and might be considered self reliant bysomebdody. oh and some vague republicans are defensive about it —perhaps that is all meant as a glowing endorsment…after all it might work for some children as long as their parents have recognizable views I agree with and thus isn’t indoctrination…
Here are two fun democratic assumptions besides the obvious 9/11 and Bush stealing elections…
Can you be against socialized medicine(or even this bill) and compassionate?
Are men and women different? ( yes or no…but please measure the squirming time and number of answer changes)
Comment by britt — February 10, 2010 @ 2:32 pm
Are the server Gods angry at T&S now?
Comment by Stephanie — February 10, 2010 @ 2:46 pm
Did not mean to insult homeschoolers- I would love to do it, but I’m a little lazy. And I calculated I would have to live here 140 years to pay for my kids education through property and sales tax, etc. So I’m a “drain” on the taxpayers, (going back to the welfare argument of the lost post).
Comment by SarahJane — February 10, 2010 @ 5:26 pm
This quote scares me a bit.
Are there really people out there who think that the public schools should dictate what parents are or aren’t allowed to teach their chidlren (even weird fundamentalist views?) The day the government forces parents to teach their children a gov’t approved curriculum is the day we’ve *truly* started to succumb to some kind of fascist regime, IMHO.
Sorry to be so flame-ish. It just really scares me, that comment.
Comment by sare — February 10, 2010 @ 6:04 pm
Did Quimby leave FMH? I must have missed that.
Comment by Cecile — February 10, 2010 @ 7:11 pm
Mark Brown, the Florida Supreme Court had ordered a statewide madated recount which by every measure i have been able to find would have given the election to Gore.
It was only the intervention of the United States Supreme Court that required those conservative (only when useful) Supreme Court justices to totally and completely abandon their previously articulated states’ rights principles to stop the recount and hand over the election to Bush. Shamefully. As I mentioned earlier, the opinion cannot be used as precedent. Why? Because they’re ashamed of it? One may speculate.
On to the number of Iraqis killed during the Iraq war. Your favorite measure appears to be the World Health Organization report published by the New England Journal of Medicine (I think. I couldn’t quite tell, so if I’m wrong, please let me know.) That report stated (in an appendix that required a couple of numbers be multiplied together) that the Iraq war has produced 400,000 excess Iraqi deaths as of June, 2006. Note, this is different than violent deaths, but if your child dies because he gets dynastery from an unclean water supply, he’s as dead as if shot.
Now, it’s Feb. 2010. The most dangerous period of the Iraq war was from late 2006 through 2007. Not adjusting the numbers at all, but extrapolating from the 2003- 2006 numbers to today, we get, conservatively, 700,000 excess dead Iraquis.
Plus, there’s 4 million (roughly) Iraqi refugees in and out of the country, over 20% of the Iraqi babies are chronically malnourished, and the list of the horrors goes on. Go us.
What were we arguing about?
Comment by djinn — February 10, 2010 @ 7:41 pm
I am so glad you are back fmh. Salt Lake Snacker? I am in….but lets for go the park idea…too cold. Do we need a house..mine is open.
Way back on #18…we just had family pictures done with my 4 kids and 3 dogs. When we started to pile out of the mini van a half hour later for lunch we realized we had left one of the dogs at the studio…..That was a little embarrassing….we love him enough to put him in our family pictures but not enough to take him home.
I have a friend who tells me if I lived in another state I would know just as many crazy democrats. But I live in UT, so we get mostly republician parinoia. We had one guy try to get us to all take our kids out of school and form a neighborhood school because public schools are close to socialism. He forced his overwhelmed wife to pull their 6 kids. She refused to teach them because she was so mad. He said he would….eight weeks later they were all back in school. Side note….I do homeschool one of my 4, because it is right for him, not because I am afraid of the goverment.
Comment by kandi and salt — February 10, 2010 @ 8:25 pm
I realize I’m late to the party, but i brought treats!
Questions/Answers:
“Do you think George Bush should currently be in prison, yes or no?”
George Bush should be in the Hague for War Crimes
“Do you think Cheney is the anti-Christ? Yes or no?”
No. However, like his President, Cheney should be in the Hague charged with war crimes.
“Do you agree with redistributing wealth? Yes or no?”
We have taxes. That was the entire point of the Constitution. That famous one, that I (totally guessing here) are for. the one passed in 1788. Of course. It redistributes wealth for the specific reason that the Articles of Confederation did not give enough taxing authority to the central government and were unworkable.
“Do you think all Republicans are evil? Yes or no?”
Of course not. Knowing someone is Republican tells you very little about them.
“Do you believe that all illegal immigrants should be granted citizenship? Yes or no?”
No. This is a stupid question, which by its very phrasology assumes that all people who are in the country illegally share some common characteristic rather than the stated one. As a thought experiment, all you mothers out there, imagine yourselves illegal aliens with American children. (Perhaps your parents brought you to the us when you were under a year old.) Perhaps you married a citizen without all your paperwork crossing its t’s and dotting its i’s.
How many of you are willing to abandon your children to go back to your country of origin to wait the extended time for your appropriate visa to come through, if at all?
Comment by djinn — February 10, 2010 @ 9:03 pm
drat “and was unworkable.” etc.
Comment by djinn — February 10, 2010 @ 9:04 pm
Or, Mark Brown, is your point that 700,000 dead Iraqis (as determined by the original WHO study that you positively reviewed, which I scaled to today, ignoring the escalating violence from the period after the initial death reports –2006 to early 2008) is just totally cool? I mean, they’re not (insert appropriate group you feel appropriate here.)
i’m not calling you a racist. Out loud,
Comment by djinn — February 10, 2010 @ 9:13 pm
the weather is supposed to be beautiful saturday. here are some park ideas:
http://www.chdmag.com/ten-to-watch/best-san-francisco-parks
Comment by jeannine — February 10, 2010 @ 9:37 pm
Mark Brown, what were we arguing about? Oh, yeah, What You clearly think that killing somewere in excess of 500,000 Iraqis (notice that i am totally lowballing (to a degree I find disconcerting) the numbers of deaths according to all studies including the ones you appear to agree with) is like totally KOOLLLL!!!! Because, uh, because– Osama Bin Laden was born in the country next door, even though he belonged to the wrong religion and really really didn’t like those [warning, requires a bit of history] those conquerers of his people who had this annoying habit of treating them rather poorly?
Comment by djinn — February 10, 2010 @ 9:46 pm
server Gods mad at t&s? We all take turns.
Remember all. To keep your server happy, sacrifice the occasionally xkcd comic. Appropriate measures are, but not limitied to, burning, burying, or making something with chocolate when thinking of it.
Comment by djinn — February 10, 2010 @ 9:50 pm
djinn,
You’re mistaken about me.
Comment by Mark Brown — February 10, 2010 @ 9:51 pm
Mark Brown, I’m not sure what you mean by me being wrong about you; as you slandered pretty much everyone to the left of Rush Limbaugh. If I misunderstand (which is always more than possible) please give me more information, if you like.
Comment by djinn — February 11, 2010 @ 1:12 am
oh, Mark Brown, I’m willing to publically admit that I could quite possibly have misunderstand youl I so, please forgive me.
However, unfortunately, my life has not consisted of gaily leaping from flower to flower, lapping up the nectar contained within, though for longer than was appropriate I thought it was, to the endless detriment of not only me buf of my poor offspring.
Not not not not not not not your problem. But, i’ve lost at last some of my innocence. So, some proof, please.
Comment by djinn — February 11, 2010 @ 2:52 am
personally I thought Saddam Hussein was just the type of guy to run that particular country Djinn. Kurds, they were with the Iranians, bigger jerks than Saddam. Kuwait, bunch of jerks there too. Iraq invades Kuwait, big deal there, guess who has to fix it. US. Sanctions for like 12 years whole bunch of kids die. Bad situation all around… http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_sanctions since wikipedia is cool for sources here… So.. what do we do, Saddams all pissed at us and if we keep on with the sanctions well bunch of kids are gonna die, if we lift the sanctions well he’s probably gonna get all crazy again. Shiites well theyre buddies with the Iranians big reason why we liked Saddam over the Iranians in the first place… Kurds, too unpredictable… Sunnis can’t take Saddam out without pissing them off… It’s been an F’d up situation since the British drew up the boundaries to make that POS country. F’it. Should have just let Saddam take Kuwait, but no we had to “do the right thing” with a lot of poking and prodding form a bunch of other countries that wanted to “do the right thing” as long as we do most of the work. Then we get some jerk named Osama Bin Laden who’s butt hurt because the King of Saudi didn’t want his help and instead preferred the US military, now this jerk is all over our S and even says the sanctions are part of why he has a problem. F*** the middle east.
Comment by SUNNofaB.C.Rich — February 11, 2010 @ 11:59 pm
djinn, just so you know.
I think you are a good person, and I’m quite certain I would like you if we ever met in person. And I hope that you would like me back.
My purpose in even commenting was to say that I think paranoia and extremism are fairly evenly distributed across the political spectrum. That’s all. I don’t mind if you disagree, since I think you’re kinda cool.
Peace.
Comment by Mark Brown — February 12, 2010 @ 10:44 am
I agree with #183… we can do nothing right by the middle east, the whole world should have probably just left them to themselves back in the day. Unfortunately, it didn’t. Now the whole world is in a catch 22 with regards to them.
Comment by April — February 12, 2010 @ 11:15 am
I get really tired of people calling each other bigoted/racist/stupid/crazy. Being passive aggressive about it doesn’t make it go away. Please stop. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions.
Comment by April — February 12, 2010 @ 11:21 am
I think you’re pretty cool too, Djinn.
Comment by SUNNofaB.C.Rich — February 14, 2010 @ 12:50 am